ROM debuggers (was Re: PDP-11/44 boot prompt)

From: Eric Smith <eric_at_brouhaha.com>
Date: Sun Nov 1 21:50:24 1998

"D. Peschel" <dpeschel_at_u.washington.edu> wrote:
> Also, your claim is totally opposite from the previous claim
> (that's what I meant by "degree").

No. Totally opposite and equal in degree from the original claim that
all Apple computers have a ROM debugger would be the claim that no Apple
computers have a ROM debugger (or equivalently, all Apple computers do not
have a ROM debugger). Both are universal claims.

The claim that some X have Y is a much weaker claim, not at all of the
same degree. It does not assert any common property for the entire class
X.

> No. Many of the older models had a plastic switch that snapped into the
> ventilation slots; it would reset the machine or bring up a debugger.

Which has nothing to do with whether the machine has a ROM-based debugger.

> So you're right about the 128, 512, and XL, but wrong about the Plus, SE, II,
> IIx, and IIcx.

I'll concede your point on the latter machines. However, I only needed one
counterexample to prove my assertion.

I didn't say anything about the XL. Actually, *you* are wrong about the XL;
I deliberately omitted the Lisa, Lisa 2, Lisa 2/5, Lisa 2/10, and Macintosh XL
because they do have a ROM-based debugger. I've used it a lot lately.

> I know many newer machines have Open Firmware (hold down Cmd-Opt-O-F when
> turning on -- the letter O, not zero) which could be used for debugging, if
> you're evil and know FORTH. :)

Which is one reason why I didn't mention them. The others being:

1. I stated that I was only listing machines relevant to the list charter.

2. It is not clear that FORTH can be considered a debugger/monitor, any
    more than BASIC can.
Received on Sun Nov 01 1998 - 21:50:24 GMT