V chip (was: Going totally OT )

From: Sipke de Wal <sipke_at_wxs.nl>
Date: Sat Feb 12 05:49:44 2000

I was under the impression that this list is about Vintage Computers rather
than judicial politics ...........

Sipke de Wal

(A European Citizen that also does not agree fully with the aforementioned
statements about Europe.)

----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Erlacher <edick_at_idcomm.com>
To: <classiccmp_at_classiccmp.org>
Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2000 12:38 AM
Subject: Re: V chip (was: Going totally OT )


> Well, here in the Land of the Free, there's too much exercise of freedome
> not guaranteed in any document anywhere, and not tolerated in countries in
> Europe. It would be so much simpler if there were only one punishment for
> all violations of the law, as so many infractions are worthy of that
> ultimate punishment, DEATH. The only thing that seems to vary is WHOSE
> death. If every offense were met with immediate extermination, perhaps
> followed by a posthumous apology, a lot of people would behave
differently,
> and nobody would park in my reserved space.
>
> In civilized countries, and NOT the U.S, it's common for citizens to turn
in
> their neighbors for viloating the law simply because they observe a law
> being broken, and not because it has effect on their lives. The fact is
> that HERE, in the U.S. a person picking up the phone and notifying the
> police that there's a minor crime in progress within his view is
considered,
> even by the police, worse than the offender.
>
> In the U.S. the observable lack of civilization is evidenced in the
> inability of people to inhabit a limited space as the Europeans have known
> for centuries to do. For us Americans, it's growing pains. Since
there's
> no more land to inhabit, we're having to acquire some traits of civilized
> societies because we're having to live together with more and more
> strangers, often quite different form ourselves, racially, culturally,
> linguistically, etc.
>
> Over time we're going to have to move in the direction of the European
> model, which we know works, and rely more on common observance of law as
> opposed to trying to circumvent it.
>
> Dick
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Wilson <wilson_at_dbit.dbit.com>
> To: classiccmp_at_classiccmp.org <classiccmp_at_classiccmp.org>
> Date: Friday, February 11, 2000 4:18 PM
> Subject: Re: V chip (was: Going totally OT )
>
>
> >On Fri, Feb 11, 2000 at 10:25:38PM +0000, Hans Franke wrote:
> >> Let me get this straight - there is some software to be implemented
> >> on TVs and VCRs to disable them on a contend related base ?
> >
> >Right. But remember, we're still the Land of the Free, even though most
> >European countries give their citizens a lot more freedom. See, any time
> >the majority (or better yet, a well-funded and vocal minority) wants
> something
> >censored, it's not censorship -- the founding fathers were only trying to
> >protect our rights to say stuff that everyone agrees with, they hate
> >people with unpopular tastes or opinions.
> >
> >> Just
> >> assuming that there will be some kind of add on signal (at this point
> >> I'd like to get some technical information) suplying the level(s)
> >> of whatever (what classes are named ?), who is responsible to
> >> judge the content ?
> >
> >There, you've hit the biggest problem. My understanding is that it's
just
> >a single scale -- from "not offensive" to "very offensive", according to
> >someone, somewhere. Since the government likes to see everything in
terms
> >of strict threshholds (55 MPH = no problem, 56+ MPH = OK to lay down tack
> >strips and cause a fatal crash), they've convinced themselves that
everyone
> >is offended by the same stuff. So some invisible authority gets to
decide
> >what's offensive and what isn't and everything comes prepackaged (no I
> >don't know what the protocol is for labeling the show but I assume it's
> some
> >between-visible-scan-lines thing like closed captioning is), so you're
just
> >supposed to set your TV for whatever age your kids are (they're all the
> same
> >age, right?) and leave it at that.
> >
> >> Also, are the TV stations also forced to supply the coding all the time
?
> >
> >I think it's supposed to be done per show. Like the current TV rating
> system,
> >where they put up a logo at the beginning of each show saying what its
> rating
> >is. Ridiculous... If I owned a TV network, I'd just set everything to
> "most
> >offensive" and forget about it.
> >
> >> BTW: I know there is violence on US-TV - but sex ?
> >
> >There's no *real* sex on US TV, but the bible thumpers are offended by
even
> >the hint of it. They think that nudity is inherently wrong, and I just
> >*love* the illogic that you can say anything you want but you can't use
> >certain words to say it. Say the exact same thing another way and you're
> >OK though.
> >
> >Anyway this is all just another attempt to idiot-proof the world.
Instead
> of
> >just sitting down with their kids at a young age and explaining what sex
> >is and why it should be taken seriously, the lazy absentee parents think
> >the right thing is for their kids to be prevented at all costs from even
> >looking down in the bath tub, so that they have no idea what's really
going
> >on, and it all comes as a total shock to them when they turn 18.
> >
> >People are unbelievably repressed in this country though. I thought my
> parents
> >did a pretty good job of explaining everything, but they left some
> important
> >stuff out, like the fact that sex is fun! What a mind-bender, hearing
> about
> >neighbors etc. that had gotten pregnant "by accident", I couldn't
possibly
> >imagine how people would pull off such a complicated disgusting procedure
> >without meaning to. Makes a whole lot more sense now!
> >
> >> If the judgement is
> >> done by the producer, someone of a 'nude acceping' show may have a
> >> different feeling about the 'sex rating' then the next guy who airs
> >> some TV church stuff.
> >
> >Exactly! Personally, I'm seriously, DEEPLY offended by anything to do
with
> >organized religion, yet as far as the government is concerned that stuff
> >is all strictly G-rated. So I'll never convince my TV to automatically
> >skip those shows. I have no problem with nudity though, and if I had
kids
> >I'd want them to see plenty of it too, so that the novelty would wear off
> >and they wouldn't go into total cranial shutdown the way most Americans
do
> >when they see it (since we're strongly conditioned to think that the only
> >time anyone shows any skin is when they're about to have sex with you, so
> >we act like idiots when we see people naked in other contexts). But
that's
> >the *main* thing the government wants to stop us from seeing.
> >
> >Anyway, I'm not saying the government is trying to gradually eat away at
> our
> >rights and subtly turn the USA into a totalitarian state so slowly that
no
> >one even notices. But if they WERE trying to do that, they'd go about it
> >exactly this way!
> >
> >Well anyway, I was pissed off the *last* time the gov't forced everyone
to
> >pay for an unneeded feature in their TVs, which was closed captioning,
but
> >now I use it all the time! It's really handy when the actors are
mumbling,
> >or when they're talking in funny voices for no apparent reason (but the
> >caption explains that they're quoting from a 1930s movie I never saw), or
> >when my wife falls asleep but I want to keep watching.
> >
> >Yech, sorry about all this OT stuff, this has gotten pretty far from
> finding
> >goodies in dumpsters. I once hauled an IBM 029 keypunch out of a
dumpster,
> >does that make up for it? It was at the company I worked for so there
was
> >no problem with permission, the guys who tossed it in really relished the
> >experience (I guess they hadn't been big fans of that keypunch back when
it
> >was the company's only input device) so they were telling everyone, I
> flipped
> >out of course but the same guys were nice enough to help me haul the
thing
> out
> >again.
> >
> >I've also had pretty good luck with the friendly neighborhood engineering
> >school, especially because they're too cheap to get dumpsters for every
> >building so a lot of the time stuff sits on loading docks for weeks
before
> >it gets hauled off, so you can just take it away (as long as you're sure
> >it's scrap). I got a mostly-complete ASR33 and another terminal that way
a
> >couple of years ago, and a few other things (found a VK100 GIGI minus the
> PSU
> >sitting by the curb with some other trash, outside RPI's linear
accelerator
> >a few years back). No need to get waist deep in transformer oil or
> anything
> >yucky like that...
> >
> >John Wilson
> >D Bit
> >--------------
> >P.S. guess I spoke too soon about the drought of idiotic winter accidents
> >being reported on our local TV news as "tragedies", apparently just last
> night
> >some bozo in Utica went snowmobiling in the dark and ate a tree at high
> speed.
>
Received on Sat Feb 12 2000 - 05:49:44 GMT