Bad behavior and bad language on list . . .

From: <(>
Date: Sat Jan 18 12:47:00 2003

> Add to that Sellam's consistent slander of Texas and
> Texans, ever since George Dubbya took office.? I despise Bush, but I
> *am* a native Texan, and am proud of that.? Sellam's comments to me, in
> private email, are even more culturally oriented.
> ? It is not the first time on this list, and Texans have not been his
> only target for cultural slurs and epithets.? As this is a decidedly
> multi-national and multi-cultural forum, it's always surprised me that
> the list-members in general put up with it.
Hello everyone, I don't know Doc, at least I'm not sure. Many of us have
never met others in person. I have however met Sellam, and I've corresponded
with him many time over the years. Sellam, you've always been very nice and
professional to me online and also when we met at the First East Coast
Vintage Computer Festival. But, I feel a need to say that your language and
personal attacks to people on list has really gotten out of hand. Doc, you
did yourself no favors the moment you also used the "F" word in response.
There have of course, also been some others here exhibiting bad language,
etc., in the past.

For anyone who doesn't know, when someone attacks a person personally,
instead of attacking their viewpoint, this is called an Ad Hominem attack -
ad hom?i?nem adj. Appealing to personal considerations rather than to logic
or reason: Debaters should avoid ad hominem arguments that question their
opponents' motives. Whether you are attacking their race, place of birth,
religion, sex, or yes, even choice of ISP. If everyone will excuse me a
moment, my politics are simple on social behavior - I don't care what any
consenting adults do in private, but keep it private. You can engage in gay
or "normal" sex, do drugs, curse your head off, who cares. Keep it private
and between adults only. This forum is public, and there are probably some
minors who subscribe or peruse the archives later. You have a social
responsibility to keep any and all antisocial, uncivil behavior off-line. All
of this out-of-line behavior that has been allowed to carry on this list is
out of control regularly now.

I voted for and overall like President Bush. Sellam, Doc . . . oh, am I a big
jerk or stupid now?! But of course, this has nothing to do with our hobby and
needn't ever have been revealed here. It's immature and frankly unrealistic
to think that your little "swipe" or "joke" in regard to politics is amusing
to everyone. Or, even that it impresses anyone. None of us are here to listen
to anyone's political agenda. Or their viewpoint on business ethics and
copyright law, etc. Unless these concepts are discussed in regard to a
historical, classic computer system(s) or related.

Is anyone in charge here? Is there any policing of list etiquette? Even just
internal by other members? Are there more of you out there like me? Is
everyone happy with this stuff?! I'm very tired of it. I may not "discuss"
much on here, but I read every one and I'm just as much a "member" here.

Can we please have discussion on topic, and behavior that does not insult or
offend anyone?! It's really not that hard, it just takes some discipline.
Simply treat any other person the way you want to be treated - with respect I

There, I finally did it, posted for all to see. This is ridiculous the
behavior that goes on here. Civil behavior is all that we have to keep the
foundation of our culture "civilized." All the other stuff becomes secondary.

Regards to everyone on list, David

David Greelish
Classic Computing
"classiccomputing" on eBay

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