Please see embedded comments below.
Dick
-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Pechter <pechter_at_pechter.dyndns.org>
To: Discussion re-collecting of classic computers
<classiccmp_at_u.washington.edu>
Date: Friday, April 23, 1999 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: The "FIRST PC" and personal timelines (Was: And what were
the80s
>> This "#_at_$&*() bull," was part of the party line presented by a DEC sales
>> team at a presentation I attended about fifteen years ago, on behalf of
one
>> of the "systems integration contractors" their policies were designed to
>> support. The presenters routinely referred to their clever position in
the
>> government market in the terms I used.
>
>
>Considering I worked at DEC in 81-86 and we sold DIRECT to Fort Monmouth
>I think that statement was misleading.
I was not trying to mislead anyone, but, rather, to pass along what my
colleagues and I were told at a pitch put on for us by the DEC sales force.
We were engaged in a militarization of a uVAX-II by repackaging it in our
own enclosure, with our own backplane/cardcage, and using EMULEX controllers
and a truly high-res display subsystem separate from the console. Our task
was integration-intensive. We had to buy a company in CA in order to ensure
they would be around long enough to produce our ultra-high-res display
boards, though I would have preferred to build it ourselves. That notion
was incompatible with the premise on which the contract was based (COTS
equipment, repackged to meet TEMPEST, among other standards.
Do you suppose DEC had a separate company for handling this type of
contract? That would explain the party-line that was laid out before us.
We bought their Q-bus boards but provided our own <virtually everything
else>. It seemed reasonable enough that they would take the position they
took with government/military business.
>DEC sold stuff via OEM's who often did system integration with NON-DEC
>hardware and software and packaged systems with specialized requirements.
>I remember a Martin Marietta special 11/70 in tempest cabinets with special
>requirements -- but that was not common.
>
>A large number of the DEC stuff was sold through government contractors
>because they could get machines under blanket agreements without
>some of the government procurement restrictions and approvals.
That was probably the case with our particular contract. I wasn't involved
in the procurement, which made it a curious thing that I was sent to all
these pitches. This was a "cost-plus" contract, so naturally it benefitted
everyone when we could make the cost go up. Subsequent fixed-price
arrangements had me begging our top managers to let me redesign the whole
computer/cardcage/backplane using the microVax chipset by then (9/86 or so)
available for use in BI-bus interfaces, on a VME card. I believed I could
cram all the required hardware onto a dual-height VME card (about the size
of a full Q-bus card) so we didn't have to deal with so many vendors, and
then allowing us to use more readily available hi-res graphics hardware.
The situation was so politically charged, I was called on the carpet by the
VP in charge of that contract, and, I believe, nearly fired. If I hadn't
been so fortunate as to have a long string of technical predictions
(contradicting what the JPL guys had said) which were substantiated, I
probably would have gone packing that day.
>DEC got sued (and settled with the govt) because of the following issue:
>
>GSA got higher pricing from DEC than Ma Bell on their Vax orders.
Were they buying through the same agent?
>GSA also required installation, insurance, and warranty differences
>in their negotiations for government pricing... I know -- I was dedicated
>as an installation specialist in 81 when both Bell Labs and Fort Monmouth
>were buying large amounts of Vax and DEC stuff.
>
>The GSA claimed the DEC prices for AT&T were lower than GSA prices
>which is not allowed. DEC claimed they weren't for the same configuration
>and services (which was true).
>Ma Bell paid for insurance as a line item and either installed the machines
>themselves and self insured or did away with insurance.
>
>(The govt didn't accept FOB coverage -- you sue the trucking company
>for damages. DEC had to process any warranty and go against the delivery
>company. You should see what an 11/780 looks like after it's been dropped
>off a loading dock. Card cages were smashed. H7000 power supplies where
>the card cages were. Doors bent in half. That machine was repaired
>and was still running 4 or 5 years ago.)
>
>DEC settled rather than fight the government in court on this one.
This is one of those cases where you settle because you don't think you can
find a judge smart enough to understand the issues.
>Bill
Received on Fri Apr 23 1999 - 14:08:10 BST