vintage computers and lead poisoning?

From: Tony Duell <ard_at_p850ug1.demon.co.uk>
Date: Wed Jun 9 18:28:12 2004

>
> > Well, if the manual costs, say, \pounds 40, and you do, say,=20
> > 3 repairs=20
> > using cheap components, then it's saved you money...
>
> The stuff I have does not seem to break very often. Off-hand

There is also the issue of preventive maintenance. Mechanical stuff does
benefit from _correct_ lubrication from time to time, alignment needs to
be checked, and so on. Doing that sort of thing without the manual is
somewhat difficult

(Oh, and don't assume the manufacturer got it right. Putting a catseye
disk in _new_ 3.5" drives is quite an eye-opener !)

> there's been this MP3 player that was dropped, a solar
> powered garden light, a washing machine, a cassette player
> and two TVs. The MP3 needed no manual (just glue!), the
> light was trivial to trace (probably not worth the effort
> since the fault was always going to be the LDR, but fun

Oh, most of the itme it's the NiCds that fail in those lights (and you
don't need a manual for that!)

> nevertheless), no manual needed for the washing machine
> (although I did buy that Haynes guide a while ago) and

I have this ingrained objection to Haynes manuals, based on their car
manuals, which are totally inferior to the real thing. Important stuff is
missed out, some jobs are claimed to be impossible at home (hmmm, I'll
decide what I can do, thank you), etc....

Decent washing machines (and dishwahsers) have at least a wiring diagram
tucked inside somewhere. Often with a timer cycle chart if it's a
mechanical timer. I don't think you need much more than that.

> the TVs I could find schematics for in the RTSE Guide
> (is that still going these days?). I'd be upset if
> something broke three times :-)

That depends on how long you intend to keep it for. I'd be upset if
something failed 3 times in a year, but I'd expect to have to do rather
more than 3 repairs in, say, 50 years.

>
> > I never=20
> > object to=20
> > buyunbg real service data.
>
> I'm not sure how you can tell, before buying, that the
> manual is of any use (short of having previously seen

Ask if the manual contains the circuit diagrams. If they won't tell you,
get suspicious. If they tell you it does, and it turns out that it
doesn't, then you most certainly can return it for a refund.

> one). I expect sedning it back with "insufficient data,
> please refund" won't work. I've seen Mauritron do a
> bunch of CDs with manuals - not too expensive for a

Mauritron used to be OK when they sold copies of manuals on paper. Since
I object to manuals on CD (they are totally unusable on a workbench, and
I am not spending 5 minutes per page to print the darn things [1]) I no
longer deal with them

[1] Most of that time is taken downloading the bitmap from the Mac to a
Laserwriter over localtalk...

> CD I guess but I have no idea what the manuals
> themselves would be like. I may take a punt on a
> CD if I ever need one ...

FWIW, I've never seen a TV or VCR manaul without a full schematic, but
I've not seen any really modern ones.

>
> > > Dunno. I'd want a CD player anyway :-) Maybe if I take
> >=20
> > I'd want reel-to-reel :-)
>
> Why am I not surprised :-)

Maybe you know that I put quality of construction and performance way
above convenience of use :-)

> without ever failing during my lifetime). I also
> want to minimise the amount I spend on it. I=20
> don't see why I should pay more purely to justify
> any future repairs on an economic basis. Same goes

More expensive stuff tends to be better made, tends to work better, and
is more pleasant to use.

> > And if tVs were more expensive to replace (sau a new one cost \pounds=20
> > 500) then they would be prepared to pay for repairs.
>
> When TVs were more expensive (like in the 1970s) people
> did indeed pay for repairs. I just don't think that's
> a good reason for them to be more expensive. There are

No, but modern stuff is so darn poorly made that I don't want to be
anywhere near it. And the quality of pictures on most modern TVs is
horrible (put a crosshatch generator on one sometime and look at the
convergence errors). No thanks!. The quality of the programmes is a
separate issue of course, and one that I can do nothing about.

> > Do you seriously think you should pay less than \pounds 25 per hour?=20
>
> No. But it makes no economic sense to pay say =A350 to
> fix a =A36 calculator. I happen to have a faulty Casio

That's why I specified _HP_ calculator (as if there's any other serious
brand :-)). People will pay \pounds 25 for me to repair the card reader
in their HP65 (worth a few hundred quid).

Incidendtally, the fact that I do said repairs for money doesn't mean I
won't help you fix your own HP calculator if you want to . The real
reason that I charge is that otherwise I'd have millions of card reader
rollers to repair, and quite honestly they get boring fast. Oh well...

> fx-83 and one with a shattered display (quite how
> my kids manage to achieve this I do not know). The
> innards are basically an LCD, a keypad and an IC

Now HP calculators -- real HP calculators -- are quite interesting
inside. DIL packaged ICs, 2 phase clocks, serial buses between the CPU
and memory, and so on. I've got a large pile of notes on the internals of
just about every HP desktop and handheld calculator up to the 71B

> > That's what I charge for fixing HP calculators, and I have=20
> > been told that=20
> > I am massively underselling myself. Problem is, if I charged=20
> > any more,=20
> > even fewer people would pay for the repairs...
>
> I assume that you are not offering this service as
> a business ... otherwise you would be rapidly out of

Correct. Do you think I've too cheap or too expensive? I assume the former.

> business. During my days as a freelancer I did odd
> bits on the side as the opportunity presented itself.
> I think I was charging about =A3300/day ten years ago.
> Plumbers round here seem to advertise rates as low
> as =A340/hour.=20

Problem is, if I charged \pounds 100 per hour, nobody would pay it. So I
have a choice of charging a sensible rate and getting no jobs coming in,
or charging far to little and at least getting a few machines to repair.

-tony
Received on Wed Jun 09 2004 - 18:28:12 BST

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